The Adena Point didn't cross The Mississippi River?

[CMD]

we have Adena cultural artifacts up here in R.I. too, theres been birdstones and boatstones and long nosed god pendants and adena points all found up here.i think they liked our chlorite and steatite quarries

Here is a rare style. A box head birdstone head, from Plymouth Ma. And the other one is that killer example I mentioned from a burial in Charlestown, RI. Using the grain in the rock as an eye......

[sailorjoe]

Hi Charlie. Wow! Is that your piece? If so, is that a personal find? And if so, I would love to hear the story.

[CMD]

Yes, my piece Joe, but not my find. Found at a place called Rocky Nook in Plymouth.

[clambellies]

A great piece to have in your collection!

[p kurt]

Josh I can't imagine the Mississippi river stopping the adena people. They crossed the Ohio river from Illinois to Kentucky and that would be no less of a challenge than crossing the Mississippi. I have personally found adena points near the bank of the Mississippi river in eye site of Missouri. To me it would seem impossible for the culture not to have crossed over. It is a common culture in Illinois. An interesting view is the Gary point type culture, although separate from adena culture would have had the same obstacles. Their culture from nearly the same time and spread over a vast area. I have picked up adena points across the river from Missouri, haven't picked up any in Missouri but don't believe the river was an obstacle. I believe the land was more of an obstacle than the water.

[JoshinMO]

Makes good conversation either way.

[Scorpion68]

Joe is right, CMD. WOW!! Those would make a beautiful addition to any collection. Nice pieces. ...Chuck

[Neanderthal]

The Adena people didn't have much of a presence west of the Mississippi River Valley. You will see signs of them every now and then, but not a lot. The same goe

[Neanderthal]

This software froze up and I hit enter before finished. *Continuing*

The same goes for Kirk. You will see sporadic sign throughout the Mississippi River valley, but not really much further west. Many prehistoric cultures did (apparently) use waterways as boundary markers. I'm not saying that they didn't cross those waterways, they did..on occasion; however, they were a natural range borderline. You'll find that this holds true for most of the large waterways throughout the U.S. (Red River, Rio Grande, Arkansas, Missouri, etc).

The Arkansas River Valley is the extent for the Hopewell (as recognized in the Ozarks Plateau), and several others.

[Neanderthal]

Josh I can't imagine the Mississippi river stopping the adena people. They crossed the Ohio river from Illinois to Kentucky and that would be no less of a challenge than crossing the Mississippi. I have personally found adena points near the bank of the Mississippi river in eye site of Missouri. To me it would seem impossible for the culture not to have crossed over. It is a common culture in Illinois. An interesting view is the Gary point type culture, although separate from adena culture would have had the same obstacles. Their culture from nearly the same time and spread over a vast area. I have picked up adena points across the river from Missouri, haven't picked up any in Missouri but don't believe the river was an obstacle. I believe the land was more of an obstacle than the water.

The waterway itself wasn't an obstacle, but the people on the other side sure could be.

The vast majority of the contracting stemmed types that people call "Gary", aren't. There are a myriad of different forms with enough spatial and temporal differences to show that they are completely different people..yet collectors still try to lump them all into one easy type.

[Kyflintguy]

The Adena people didn't have much of a presence west of the Mississippi River Valley. You will see signs of them every now and then, but not a lot. The same goes for Kirk. You will see sporadic sign throughout the Mississippi River valley, but not really much further west. Many prehistoric cultures did (apparently) use waterways as boundary markers. I'm not saying that they didn't cross those waterways, they did..on occasion; however, they were a natural range borderline. You'll find that this holds true for most of the large waterways throughout the U.S. (Red River, Rio Grande, Arkansas, Missouri, etc).

The Arkansas River Valley is the extent for the Hopewell (as recognized in the Ozarks Plateau), and several others.

I can accept that logic, not that they couldn't or never did... just that it was uncommon for that specific group or culture to do so by reconcognizing the Mississippi as a natural territory boundary. Makes sense to me and I can see how rivers, mountains or other natural barriers could become traditional boundaries used by different groups of pepole in ancient times.

[Kyflintguy]

The waterway itself wasn't an obstacle, but the people on the other side sure could be.

I think you touched on another point that has archaeological validation. I wish everyone had the book "Prehistoric men of Kentucky" by Colonel Bennett H Young. There is a fascinating recount of early Native American lore about the battles waged along the Ohio and Mississippi river and the evidence left by the moundbuilders such as earthen walls and forts substantiates the idea that there was major conflict along those natural boundaries in ancient times....

[waterglass]

The heck of it is the plagues that the europeans brought with them far out paced european exploration. I have read that a large percentage of the native population was wiped out in just the two decades after first contact. Any civilizations that existed were probably abandoned decades or even centuries before the remnants were discovered. Wood, thatch or dirt structures would quickly disappear in many parts of the Americas. unmortared stone is easily toppled by earth quakes, or washed away in floods.

The death rates I have read about would have ended any civilzation that might have existed, and quite possibly even the memory of it, considering that information was passed down through crude pictograph and oral traditions.

[Kyflintguy]

Ok TAKE TWO, first post erased while adding photos... These are some of my Adena related artifacts. The first two blades are from central Ky and made from Boyle's chert. The large UN notched ovate blade was found by a guy I know while digging post holes for a deck remodel. The group of three are from western TN. The lighter banded two being Dover chert. The last brown point with a fire pop was a gift from a friend and was found in Ky.

[clambellies]

Well, enough of them crossed the Mississippi to make it into Jeff Boudreau's New England Typology Book.

[Kyflintguy]

The jist of JoshinMo's initial question to this thread was reffering Adena crossing over to the west side of the Mississippi... Those are some beautiful Adena points!