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  • Augmonic
    replied
    True , The sanctity of life should be respected even in death ...

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  • south fork
    commented on 's reply
    It was a burial that should be enough .

  • Augmonic
    replied
    Wrong in whose eyes ?

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  • Ron Kelley
    replied
    Regardless of who's ancestors they were (and we don't know) decimation of that burial site was WRONG!

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  • south fork
    replied
    This site / Mound was just across the bay they most likely could see each others smoke . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emeryville_Shellmound

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  • SGT.Digger
    replied
    Every dam that’s built covers untold amounts of artifacts buried under water forever. The pecos , devils river/Rio grand river is a classic example of burying untold dry shelters with invaluable perishables/organics . Most of the roads built along rivers pave over many sites with Little to no work done . My uncle worked for the highway Dept and had to have state archeological studies done during road projects and there was a huge mound brm near a bridge and they purposely dug on the opposite side of the road and said they found nothing and gave an all clear which is standard operating procedure . Oh well

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  • Hal Gorges
    commented on 's reply
    Just rescanned the article...My comment doesn’t make any sense,..Lol

  • CMD
    replied
    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021...-some-want-new

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  • Mattern
    commented on 's reply
    Well I was talking about the Native standards not ours. I do agree with you and Glen. There are plenty of places they could have built in my opinion. Kim

  • tomf
    replied
    Originally posted by Mattern View Post
    I don't know when I'm dead I'm dead! If someone wants to pry my rings off my bones, who am I to stop them. I believe in the santivety of the Tribes. But if they stop one project because of NA antiquities and not another doesn't make sense to me, they should have a national standard. Very interesting read (double standard). Kim
    I don't see a double standard. I have witnessed countless times when NA sites have been bulldozed, farmed, paved over and disregarded by developers (mostly white, for the record) with hardly a thought of impact on either archeology or indian feelings. Also plenty of examples of exhumations for development.

    https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/...cated%E2%80%9D

    This is America and, for better or worse, property rights and money set the rules. In this case Graton band are simply exercising those same rights.
    Personally, I agree with South Fork that it would have been nice to leave it untouched, but I'm not about to lecture indians on how to respect their dead ancestors.





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  • Mattern
    replied
    I don't know when I'm dead I'm dead! If someone wants to pry my rings off my bones, who am I to stop them. I believe in the santivety of the Tribes. But if they stop one project because of NA antiquities and not another doesn't make sense to me, they should have a national standard. Very interesting read (double standard). Kim

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  • south fork
    replied
    Its about the money Larkspur got 2 1/2 acres of land worth millions what did the Graton Band get ? This should have been fenced and left alone all the experts have more than enough remains to study . There were many mounds mined for the shell all around the bay . Another way to look at this would you want your family paved over ?

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  • tomf
    replied
    I remember this story. Tainted by money and local politics but still, at it's core, about Archeology versus Tribal sovereignty. Though I sympathize with the archeologists , I side with the tribes.
    Truth is, there has been extensive study of shell mounds and archeological sites around the San Francisco bay for more than a century. Investigations in Larkspur might possibly bring some new insight (condor find is amazing, though I doubt they were being kept as pets), but more likely it would just add statistical data that wouldn't significantly advance our knowledge.
    Indians rightly see artifacts as cultural property, have no historic love for archeology, nor the will to accommodate it and can, in a case like this, exert some power in the real world.
    If they choose to relocate ancient remains and pave it over, so be it. If they make a little money and political headway in the process, so be it. Whatever the motivation, there's no reason to believe it's anything but the will of the tribes.
    People who love artifacts as objects will mourn the loss. People who see artifacts cultural remains may find it more forgivable/understandable/appropriate.

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  • gregszybala
    replied
    Money...

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  • Hal Gorges
    replied
    Very interesting, ..Burials before the bow and arrow, hmmm...good read Dennis.
    Last edited by Hal Gorges; 03-16-2021, 01:35 PM.

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