Ind. collector

[pkfrey]

Has anyone ever heard of a collector by the name of Grey LaDosser? From Indiana. I got a catlinite pipe in from a larger collection that is reported as being acquired from Grey LaDosser. I was trying to find out when he lived and collected, or any info on him would help document this pipe. Thanks.

[clovisoid]

A very well known collector, but I think you are mispelling his last name.  Let me check a couple of old books when I get home.

[pkfrey]

OK Thank you, I appreciate that. Here's some photos of the pipe. It's a later bowl form, ca. 1890s, with a spindle stem.

[clovisoid]

It came to me with the help of google playing around with the spelling.
The well known collector is Gray Ladassor, but he was from -and- lived in the Illinois/Missouri area (died in 1980.)  He bought, sold, traded and dug a lot of great artifacts from great collectors and sites.  A good bit of his better material is pictured in multiple books and journals (he was the editor of the Central States Arch Journal for a while back in the 1950's I believe.)
Unfortunately he's one of those names that people like to put on old relics since he's not around to vouch for them.  You'd really need to dig through some paper to find it pictured somewhere.  The pipe almost looks to have some ancient patina from spending time in the dirt which would make the stem probably not as old.

[pkfrey]

That's exactly what I'm trying to do. But I needed to start somewhere, and find out who Gray LaDosser was. Now I can research his collection if I can find any information on the internet. Thank you for your help, i really appreciate it.

[clovisoid]

There should be a lot of good stuff out there.  I have all of the Central States Arch Journals from when he was alive and I flip through them when I get bored, I'll keep my eye out for the pipe.
Ladassor also excavated a lot of Illinois mounds with Greg Perino -and- Walter Wadlow, so some of his stuff also shows up in more obscure 'science-y' journals and entries.

[pkfrey]

Well thank you! I appreciate your effort! And I understand what your saying about people using well known names to document an artifact. BUT, wouldn't you then have to be suspect of EVERYTHING you purchase? IF there isn't a photo of the artifact with the reported ex. collector, that would cause skepticism among every artifact collector in the entire country who purchases artifacts. Normally what I do when I acquire a collection, is first determine the integrity of the collector I'm buying from. Then I do all the research I can before I sell anything, and I do my best to make sure the reported documentation is verifiable and accurate.  I can't assume that EVERY artifact I buy or sell has false or fake information with it. If we did that, no one would ever buy anything. Faking documentation does run rampant, but that's a problem I don't think there is a cure for. If Mr. LaDasser passed away in 1980, then he at least collected in the same timeline as the person I'm currently dealing with. There's an extensive catalog with detailed information on every artifact in the collection, and at this point, I have to think the artifacts are being presented with accurate documentation.
Please be bored a lot, I really need a photo of that pipe! Thanks!

[clovisoid]

pkfrey wrote:

And I understand what your saying about people using well known names to document an artifact. BUT, wouldn't you then have to be suspect of EVERYTHING you purchase?

  I think his name is used more than other collectors simply because copies of his catalog aren't floating around like they are with Meuser, Copeland, BW Stephens, Townsend, etc.  If someone tells you an item came from Meuser's collection, you can relatively quickly look up that number and see if the picture/description/size at least fit what you are buying.  Some other guys has pretty unique handwriting or marking styles.  For Ladassor it's just a little more difficult because I haven't ever seen a copy of his catalog that shows you the bulk of his collection.  Maybe some of the Illinois/Missouri guys have seen it, or understand his marking system well enough to know if something is legit or not.
Anyway, it's all part of the joy of collecting...  Finding it in the dirt, or finding it in an old book.

[pkfrey]

I understand what your saying, in this instance however, and concerning this pipe, the collection I'm dealing with was assembled by my consignors father in the early 1900s until 1960, when my consignors dad passed away. So Mr. LaDasser would still be living and actively collecting, which could have easily been verified back then, so I don't think his name was simply used. I don't know the circumstances of how the pipe went from Mr. LaDasser to my consignors dad, but that could easily of happened through a variety of circumstances. I'll keep digging. You gave me something to go on, I appreciate that, Thanks!