I think I've been had. Need help!

[PointHound]

Just got this in the mail today. Never bought a point before and might not ever again. I haven't been finding much of my own here lately so I decided I would shop around a little. I found this supposed G10 Decatur going for a fair decent price and kind of bought it on impulse. Seemed like a good idea at the time. It came from way out of my area but Decatur's are my favorite archaic point type and there is a good chance I will never find one of this quality in the field. The flaking and patina looked about right in the picture's but now I have it in my hand I am not quite sure. Don't know if its just because I didn't find it but something just doesn't feel right, seems a little to perfect. The way the base is fractured seems kind of suspect as well. It was supposedly found in Hickman county Kentucky and is made from Sonora chert. Before I send it back I would like some of you guys expert opinion's. If other angles and close ups are needed let me know.

[Hiddenvalley]

The notches look modern , as does the rest of the piece. The lithic , Sonora chert , is common to Kentucky. I could be wrong , others with more knowledge will weigh in.

[PointHound]

yeah. that's what I thought. It looked right in its original post. Thought I would take a chance with it. Won't make that mistake again. thanks

[sneakygroundbuzzard]

my thoughts are that it is a modern piece.
but im no expert by any definition of the word,but i do flint knap

[pkfrey]

Send it back while you still have time for a refund. You bought that from a seller who is known for selling fakes and repros, and you didn't mention the COA it came with. I'm sure it's the same one, comes with a faker Baker paper. The tips of the serrations are to sharp for the age, there's no visible ground contact indications, and the typology is off for a resharpened decatur. The pictures of the piece as advertised do show some areas that might pass as dirt, or something on the point, but your photos are much clearer, and the point just doesn't have the aged appearance expected on a Decatur. You must have washed the point after you received it. If you did, put the dirt back on. Wet the point and rub some dirt on it. It has to be in the same condition you received it for the refund. Don't feel bad, if you don't make mistakes, your not learning.

[PointHound]

I am going to send it back for sure. I got 14 days and am gonna start tomorrow. It did come with a baker coa. I didn't do anything with the point. The pictures I posted are as it came. It Does look a little different from the original post don't it? I was thinking about breaking it and returning it saying it arrived broken so he doesn't sell it to some other sucker. In my opinion people like that hurt the hobby and kill the market. If I ever do buy a point from ebay again it will be a field grade point with no doubt about authenticity. Thank you!

[paohrocks]

For what its worth attached are a couple of pics of a Decatur I found in 1998 in Preble County Ohio, its made from Coshocton Gray. Thought it might serve as a good reference.

[PointHound]

Nice one man! I have only found one here in Va.. So thin well made with beautiful flaking' kind of makes ya question authenticity in the field

[paohrocks]

Thanks, the only thing sticking out of the ground was the tip...talk about a shocker when I pulled it...its the only one in my collection.

[Kyflintguy]

I'm guessing eBay maybe? It's really to good to be true if you scored it really cheap. A very fine authentic Decatur that size and perfect is not cheap. Some people think oh I scored a deal of a lifetime, nah you scored a fake 98 percent of the time... Another clue would be what does the other items the seller offers look like? A whole bunch of perfect points that are not selling or selling way cheaper than they should is a bad sign.
I can't really see the finer details in your photos but the odds don't look good if you scored it really cheaply via internet auction. Decatur's are highly faked similar to other Early Archaic knives and Paleo lanceolates.
I've made some bad buys before myself, I've tried to learn from them when it has happened. It can be a rocky road trying to learn and buy at the same time. One of the first rules of thumb is something that looks to good to be true probably is. There is lots of other good advice about purchasing artifacts on this site. That one your showing just gives me a bad feeling. Hope that helps!

[utilized flake]

If it came with a baker paper I wouldn't even look at the computer pictures!

[PointHound]

[Broken Arrow]

The carefully worded description of the piece is very telling. On the surface it seems to briefly describe the piece but inside that is a slick disclaimer that this is a repro and he knows it. Deconstruct the language of the description and you'll see it. Lets get started. 1st: "This artifact is SUGGESTED to date from the early archaic period". Is that a manufacturer suggestion? LOL! (SUGGESTED: Cause one to think that (something) exists or is the case.) Baker's first statement is a nod to the knapper's ability to create a piece that will cau$e potential buyer$ to think that a piece i$ authentic. There is no reason to suggest.
!!! On a COA: If I wanted to note the time period the piece is from, I would note the rcd range, or the date ranges for the stratigraphy where these points are found in excavations, or I would just state the time period as fact.
2nd: "The workmanship is consistent with ancient techniques". (WORKSMANSHIP: The degree of skill with which a product is made.) Baker's second statement is an ambiguous way of saying the modern knapper was adequate enough to reproduce this product. That could mean anything, from being able to bang some rocks together and use a tine flaker, to being able to include enough of the diagnostic criteria that make up the basic typology of a given type. On a COA: If I wanted to speak to the workmanship of a piece, I would note the diagnostic criteria of the type and explain/show how the piece meets those criteria.
3rd: "There is good overall patination and mineralization that is compatible with an artifact of this age." (COMPATIBLE: (of two things) able to exist or occur together. (Of one thing) consistent with another.) compatible? Baker's third statement is simply saying that the patina on this piece(faked or non-existent) is able to exist with an artifact "of this age". Here he is, once again, attempting to undermine peoples Intelligence by saying this patina is able to exist or occur among points of this type. But the only evidence he has to prove this is the piece he papered so it becomes self proving. Another thing about compatibility, the knock off store brand items are compatible with name brand items but the two are not the same.
He knows what he is doing. He knows that others know what he is doing. This guy is a a smooth criminal. Baker knows that his clever word usage is misleading, but he also knows that if it all comes crashing down he can argue that he was telling the truth the whole time but people didn't understand his language usage.
Sorry for the long comment. This is just kinda how I see the way he has his scam set up. Does that make sense?

[utilized flake]

You've been struck by...a smooth criminal! I love it broken arrow!!! And I absolutely hate it Jeff Baker

[Artifascination]

Don’t get discouraged from getting a good point. There are plenty out there just look past the too good to be true points and look at the ones from trusted sellers. There are some good sellers on here and a couple on eBay.

[Benji]

Hey pointhound...looks like a legit point to me...but im no expert to say it is or isnt..the base does look sketch
..im sure pics do not do it justice as far as overall appearance when viewing in person..sounds like your intuition is telling you fake...ive never purchased an artifact and not sure i would....something about finding them on my own has more of a satisfaction....but i get it and by no means knocking you for it.....from pics looks like a nice piece regardless of its authenticity but you certainly wouldnt want to pay a high price for a repro...

[Josie]

I don't know who Baker is but only know what I read here. Why's this guy still in business? I guess he can anger the right person one day and maybe some type of enforceable cease and desist order could be imposed after proving he's a fraud. Surprising that someone hasn't put Baker in his place.

[utilized flake]

It's sad really imagine the people that have sent him legitimate artifacts that he papered and now the artifacts that were actually real are worthless because his name is linked to them. Money isn't the root of all evil, Greed is! Maybe he will start authenticating those crazy rock art pieces that are for sale on ebay!

[Looks2Much]

I suspect he’s still in business because he’ll take money and authenticate fakes. This would make him the preferred authenticator for everyone making fakes. I’m always amazed by the number of fake points being sold online.

best of luck to the OP with the return, that’s a bummer

[sailorjoe]

The serrations on the edges look too fresh and sharp and no obvious patina among a couple of other things that don't look quite right to me. Always best to have it in hand to say for sure. I've seen quite a few Decaturs. I had 16 personal finds in my old collection. I have one that I showed 3 or 4 years ago. It is a dart point unlike many we find that are knives.

[Tam]

My 2 cents . If you don’t feel good about it now , you never will . You will look at that point with question and disappointment . Not worth spending money on bad thoughts !

[tomclark]

Tam is right on. Don't feel bad, get even while you can. I had to learn my lesson...ONCE. Never again. Never Forget! Bought a "killer" at a local artifact show. Had to have it. @15 years later when I winnowed my collection to just personal finds I sold it and it came back. A $60 mess to buy, sell and have returned.