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WHY GET PAPERED?

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  • WHY GET PAPERED?

    This is more of a statement than a blog but feel free to chime in. My name is Robert Butler and I'm an authenticator. I'm not on here to debate why or why not or argue about things that I can not see, touch, smell or put under a microscope, but I am here to tell you that many of you have fakes in your collections and don't know it. Some of you don't care but I'll bet the odds are that the vast majority of you do. In the collecting world there is nothing worse, at least in my mind, than to try and build an authentic collection of artifacts, that you believe is real, only to find out later that up to 30% or more of your collection is FAKE.
    We all know that no one is perfect at anything therefore authenticators have that same flaw. However the simple truth is, where we make one mistake out of every several hundred or thousand evaluations you have made that mistake 30 to 40 percent of the time. Those are the cold hard facts for the majority of collectors. Some folks have an even more horrifying number of fakes in their collections. Talk about a Ponzi scheme, this hobby/business is rife with people trying to scam you.
    Speaking as an authenticator I can tell you for a fact that unless you have found the artifacts yourself or you have had an experienced authenticator look them over and issue a COA then it is almost certain that many of your prized pieces, which you have spent hundreds if not many thousands of dollars on, are fakes. If a well studied and experienced authenticator who has spent many, many years of his life perfecting his craft and has all the tools of the trade, costing thousands of dollars, can make a mistake just think about what your odds are.
    People do not realize or understand the numbers involved. There was a time when you could buy on e-bay or at an artifacts show and be fairly confident that you were getting what you were paying for. Today we are looking at an industry so overloaded and over-run with fakes, modern made, re-chips, and restorations that you are literally playing in a crap shoot or if you don't know what that is, how about playing Russian Roulette, except, instead of playing with one bullet in your six shooter your playing with three. Do you like those odds? People have lost there souls to the almighty dollar and integrity and honesty are almost a distant memory. The intellectual infrastructure of our country is falling apart because our government is more concerned with being politically correct and giving free hand outs than with work ethics and the morals necessary for a mentally stable and healthy environment. So, please tell me, how is it that you still trust a perfect stranger who feeds you a line of BS and smiles as he takes your money but you don't have the good common sense to spend $10 to $20 dollars to certify that the point you just spent $400 dollars on. If your willing to spend $500 dollars on 5 relics that have no documentation or COA's, why wouldn't you send them off to a professional to have them evaluated. If he kills it don't be mad at the messenger, go after the fraud and thief that lied and stole from you. This is called hedging your bets. It's your insurance policy. This also takes the guessing and hoping out of your purchase. Would you be happy to find out years later that you do in fact have a number of FAKES in your collection.
    I take my work very seriously and my integrity and reputation are more important than money. I'm retired from teaching and while this is my business it is not the driving force that it might have been when I was thirty. Age has given me experience and experience has given me insight and insight has opened all kinds of doors to me. The biggest driving force in me is the desire to stamp out fakes in this business/hobby, choking off the frauds who make and sell the fakes to thieves knowing that they are selling to people who are re-selling them to naive and unsuspecting collectors for huge profits. This is a multi-million dollar business, (fraud), that is akin to drug smuggling or a Ponzi scheme as in "Enron". All of which are crimes perpetrated through lies, deceit, evasion, cross boarder, (state borders), trafficking ect. Stop and think about it!! It's not the few little deals here or there, it's the little deals plus the thousands of big deals that add up over time that make it worth the risk. Easy money attracts lazy people. It's easy to tell a buyer, I didn't know it was fake!! They just give you your money back. If you were lucky enough to find out that you were taken and lucky enough to catch up with these scumbags before they moved on under another name you might get your money back. Maybe!!
    It all seems harmless at first but it starts with someone saying they are knapping for recreational purposes or for educational purposes which is all well and fine but when this folks begin to see that they are selling large numbers of their freshly made points to the same people, you'd think some bells -and- whistles would be ringing. From here the points move on to the thieves who transform the points into something that resembles an old point and or actually do the selling on e-bay or sell at shows or wherever they can, for huge profits. These are the good, fine folks who tell you their fantastic stories of how, "My Grand Father found it 40 years ago on his farm while plowing the fields". "Yea, he put them in a cigar box and were forgotten about until we found them while cleaning out the attic". Or, how about, "I found these points over several years while on camping trips with my family. Most of them were found along a creek near Glendale, Arkansas". Or, how about, "My dad found these as a young boy while tramping around the Rattlesnake River not far from Chillicothe, Ohio". And, the best ones are when they look you right in the eye and tell you, "I found these near such and such lake, river, valley, or gully. I found them laying there along this feeder creek which flows into Lake Sam Rayburn where there is this old Paleo site that no one knows about. I've found some great stuff there over the years". Oh really!!
    Man, I can't tell you how many stories I've heard like this. These guys seem to take almost as much pride in telling their lies as they do in stealing your money. Hell, these thieves might as well be fishing in a one acre pond stocked with ten thousand Walleye or Catfish. They wait for the nibble, set the hook and reel your dumb a$$ in. They got-cha!!! You bought it, hook, line and sinker. Your now the new, proud owner of a great big FAKE with a great big story to go along with it.
    I just amazes me that we are so trusting of strangers. We spend our money and paychecks like it's burning a hole through our pockets but yet we don't take the precautionary steps necessary to ensure that we are actually getting what we believe we bought. You do not have to be at their mercy and there is recourse if you do get burned, but you have to act quickly as there are time limits, especially on e-bay. Get you artifacts evaluated by a pro who has handled many thousands of authentic relics and seen as many fakes. If you think for one minute that your as good or better than an authenticator then hand me whatever it is your smoking. Maybe you should think along another line and try this on for size. A papered point brings a much higher value at sale time than a non papered point. It will almost always bring what the market will bear, no matter where you are selling it or to whom. You can always put a reasonable reserve on them if required. You can always insure your points,(by themselves), if they have been papered. Otherwise you'll have to take the risk and lump them in with your total household items. Not a good idea. Especially for many collections that value in the tens of thousands of dollars.
    There is yet another thing to consider. Someday, someone whether it's you or your kids or grand kids or the person you sell them to tomorrow, they will eventually want to sell your points, (now their points). It's called, "Cashing In". Your stories of how you found them when you were a boy mean absolutely nothing to future buyers and owners. Without documentation, your collection is not as valuable as it would be with certificates of authenticity. In fact, they may only be worth a fraction of the value you thought they had. Face it, it's JUST FACT.... As collectors become more wise to the ways of the frauds and thieves they will want papers and proof of authenticity. Do you really want that hanging over your head. When a buyer you have forgotten about comes back in three years or five years and says, "HEY, I had your arrowhead(s) evaluated by two authenticators and they killed 'em" or "they killed a third of the collection". Will you have the money to fork over for returned relics or will you fight it in a court of law, (either way, money out of your pocket). I'm telling you when it comes to many hundreds or thousands of dollars, jilted buyers will want to extract something from you. If you tell em to go jump in a lake they might just jump down your throat instead. I know I would.
    There are more than just these few reasons to have your artifacts papered but the best of the reasons is for (posterity sake). The proper identification, authentication and documentation of all pertinent information that will help future collectors, investigators, archeologists and scholars to piece together the events and dynamics of a region, (ie: Culture), through time, is imperative. This is by far the one thing in our favor when fighting those who would try to stop surface hunting and collecting altogether. The future looks to the past for answers. Be a player and not someone from the peanut gallery.
    Any COA I issue will bear your name and therefore will go down in history with the artifact, and my COA's, unlike most all the others will last for many generations to come. They will be admired and enjoyed by future generations because they are laminated for a water proof and tamper proof document that will stand the test of time.
    You can increase the integrity of your artifacts by providing as much information as possible so every artifact has a home, (place of origin) and history. Helping that relic hang on to the most important thing it has to offer, is its soul. That's right, its soul. A beautifully made authentic point is just that and no more, but one that has a COA which can show provenance retains its soul and historical value. Which to some collectors is as important as the relic itself. This also expands your field of prospective buyers. There will be cases where the information is lost, in which case we must live with what we have. Without any documentation though you can bet there will never be anything of value, historically speaking, to add to this artifact.
    These are just my thoughts and I feel strongly that you are informed because an informed collector is a smart collector. Happy hunting and collecting. I hope to hear from you and hope you will take advantage of my special package deals. $50 bucks for (5)-five- evaluations is a special deal indeed and is further proof of my dedication and commitment to stamping out fakes and fraud in this hobby. It is far better to forgo buying one field grade $50 dollar point to get 5 of your existing ones certified than it is to continue taking chances with the very real possibly of throwing your money away on bad relics. For every artifact you send me over the package deal of 5 evaluations I will only charge you $10 bucks apiece. No limits on packages or pieces over 5. Nobody is offering a better deal, NOBODY. And, I guarantee you my complete HONESTY-INTEGRITY and RELIABILITY with each and every evaluation. This is my slogan and I live by it. Regards, Bob Butler

  • #2
    OK What do you guys think? I really don't care as I found all my arttifacts and if no one else belives that to bad. As far as value I don't plan on selling and the kids are going to keep them in the family when I am gone. So again who cares?

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    • #3
      I think Ive heard this before!!!

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      • #4
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        • #5
          Well then I will leave a note to get them papered before they try to get rid of them> Also you should know that our kids and our grandkids understand the value and they will not just get rid of the things we have had for almost 100 years in the family. Scare tactics about money. I just don't think so. sorry why should I spend cash to have someone look at things we found and tell us they are real.They just wont get sold around here.

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          • #6
            Robert, what area are you from and what area or type, if anything, do you specialize in?
            I would not use authentication except for value purposes, all my finds being personally found.  But I wouldn't think of sending a Florida point to a local authenticator in say, California or New York.  Local auths see the same local types, variants, materials over and over again.  Specialists, like hardstone, etc. see the same also over and over again.
            Professor Shellman
            Tampa Bay

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            • #7
              Dont say it Robert..Dont say Texas...seriously

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              • #8
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                • #9
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                  • #10
                    Well Im here to tell you that theres people here that dont much care for texas points..In fact the ones(texans}here, including myself are here to gain knowledge and luckily have made friends here in our quest for knowledge...Didnt you see wildhorse finally unloaded some of the most kickin effigys i ever seen from the columbian river?..Thats what we here for...You come bout it wrong man...You shoulda jumped in and checked out the topic at hand....j

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                    • #11
                      Iwould like to say that i have been collecting for about twenty years and never thought about getting artifacts authenticated until recently now i can answer the questions like how old is  what material is it made out of  so to me is it worth paying somebody with knowledge to tell me these things?  yes  i recently had some papered and i will continue to do so thamks Bob

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                      • #12
                        Anyone and everyone who buys artifacts from non-friends or any seller who they didn't see find it or who buys stuff from an unfamiliar area and materials or from eBay should get an authentication on the piece.  I've been fooled ONCE and that's all it took for me.  If it's fake it needs to be ballpeened.  Folks, they are faking field grade points.
                        Florida is fairly easy.  Material is Agatized Coral, Baybottom and SE'ern chert, comglomerate.  Classic typology is easy in Florida.  It's the 'tweeners, associated types and worked down points that fool people when typing.
                        I agree with Bob there are so many fakes out there and in collections.
                        This is why I think knappers should take up crocheting.  muhaha
                        Professor Shellman
                        Tampa Bay

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                        • #13
                          Bob, I do see where you are coming from, and wish you good luck in your new authenticating  business. Authentication with any value is totally based on trust. There are over 80 people in the authentication biz here in the US, and every one of them says "Trust me, I am an authenticator". Yet many never really have achieved any level of trust with the collectors that use authenticators. Their papers are basically worthless. Why is that?
                          IMO, based on my 45+ years of collecting, most either do not have the knowledge needed to be accurate, or they cannot admit that to their customers. I have seen "authenticators" buy a scope and the next week they are an expert and are papering everything. There is even a one day course in authenticity- helpful but not complete at all. Unfortunately even if an authenticator gets the knowledge he needs- will he always use it? Some will paper anything they sell, and the collectors that drink that koolaid later find out the bitter truth. Without integrity, those people are DANGEROUS to the hobby, not helpful. Who trusts any professional that is right only 75% of the time? Is my relic paper in the 25% wrong or the 75% correct? Is 90% correct really even acceptable?
                          A collector should be his own most trusted authenticator. Collect Chippendale furniture, you'd better learn a lot about Chippendale first. Same rule with artifacts. If a collector wants to collect NW pieces, how can he know they are ancient? He can collect debitage, or cheap points, or just chunks of material from the NW, until he has confidence in his own judgement. Collectors can get help from NW people such as on this and other forums, and a good collection can be built. However, many take huge shortcuts in learning and will rely on papers from a stranger from elsewhere that may not have good judgement about NW material. In this manner, many thousands of worthless papers are in existence, that not only add nothing to the value of a piece, but they teach others false info. So, I strongly disagree that a paper makes a relic more valuable, and in many cases a paper is not worth its cost to the collector. There are some papers that actually will devalue a piece when the authenticator is not widely trusted!
                          So, do I have any papers in my collection? Of course I do, hundreds of them- that happened to come with good solid relics I bought. Some papers I just toss out as worthless. Others are correct, but often the actual info on them is incorrect or incomplete. Those opinions from authenticators that I respect, I may ask them to revisit a relic and correct the paper if it's wrong, which they will do. Every one of them, the late Greg Perino included, would admit that they make mistakes and they will correct them. Every one of them has made mistakes, even the best. Unfortunately for them though, when their info or judgement is incorrect many times, they lose (or never earn) collector trust. And that is what collectors want most- trust- which must be earned over the long haul. A long time ago when this authenticator fad started, I decided to earn MY OWN TRUST through study and knowledge. It is not the easiest road although it is by far the most satisfying. This road is not for everyone though, and respected careful conscientious honest authenticators, with good knowledge and awareness of their own limitations, are sorely needed by many collectors.
                          JMO.

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                          • #14
                            Gunner1; I did not want to get after you. Just voicing my feelings. I sold off most of our family collection a few years ago. I had no papers on any of the artifacts. When I started selling on ebay I had several collectors contact me about the artifacts. Then after I sold them a few and they had a chance to look at them I was kmown for the real artifacts I was selling. Never had anyone question any of the ones sold. Never had any returned. I belive that if you are selling real artifacts it does not take long for collectors to know that.The prices I got were more than fair and we were able to downsize the collection to a point that we could easly keep. I am sure that some of the artifacts I sold got papered I just never knew of that. Anyway Sorry and I do wish you good luck.

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                            • #15
                              I use Dwain Rogers on almost all my stuff because I know him personally and he has a great reputation.I only paper artifacts that I value above $250.00. Each artifact in my collection is tagged what it is and the value, so if something happens to me the kids will not give it away, at least I hope they do not give it away, who knows.

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