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  • For Painshill

    Painshill Wrote:
    All of these things are in the quartz family. Quartz is a mineral not a rock, since it always has the same chemical composition… silicon dioxide. The variants which quartz produces are distinguished by the way in which they have crystallized and the impurities or inclusions which are present. Those things in turn influence the colour and appearance. In this case, we are talking about “cryptocrystalline” quartz. That is, the crystals are so small that there is no apparent crystalline pattern… even under high magnification.
    Although, as USGS says, “chalcedony” is a catch-all term we can be a little more precise than that. Chalcedony is a rock not a mineral. It’s composed of intergrowths of two different types of quartz: cryptocrystalline silicon dioxide plus moganite. Pure quartz is colourless and pure moganite is grey but chalcedony can be pretty much any colour, arising from mineral impurities. Yellow, brown and red tints are usually the result of small amounts of iron compounds being present.
    As we move further away from that level of purity and towards more complex methods of crystallization the variations of chalcedony are given specific names which vary from geologically acceptable lapidary terms (eg carnelian) though to ridiculously fanciful new age terms (eg Tibetan snow cloud stone).
    The generally accepted conventions are that when chalcedony has multi-coloured bands it’s termed an agate. If the banding is black and white we call it onyx… and so on. When it’s not banded but is still clear or translucent and between orange to deep red we call it carnelian. The brown variant of carnelian is called sard… and so on. Tibetan snow cloud stone? Don’t even ask!
    When there are higher levels of impurities and the particles are large enough to make the stone opaque, we call it jasper, which is commonly red from iron (III) inclusions but can also be yellow, brown or green and occasionally blue.
    Many of these terms used are not properly defined geologically and have come from the gem and lapidary trade, but are nevertheless tolerated (to varying degrees) despite being heavily mis-used by non-geologists.
    Hope that helps a bit.
    Back in the seventies I was told Tabletop chert was a Jasper Kremmling chert was a chalcedony. and from an Archaeologist that Trout creek chert referred to as Jasper as Pet palm wood, The only two things that has not changed. Is Quartzite and Obsidian. I can understand why from the granulation from Quartzite Like the Hixton and Obsidian being from of a different method of volcanic but with the same refractory elements. I do like lithic's and origin of deposits. But what has confused me what makes them separate. I know that all are silicon based material. and sands depending on the region can be coarse to fine and mineral induction will effect color.  But to use terms loosely, I just want to get the terms right.
    Look to the ground for it holds the past!

  • #2
    Hi Chase
    I'm aboout to travel to see my mother for a couple of days. She's 91 and has no internet connection capabilities  :rolf: ... and I don't have a tablet or smartphone so I'll answer in more detail when I get back.
    I'm not completely familiar with thise materials and so will have to look up the formation modes. "Tabletop" chert I've never even heard of. Might you mean Table Mountain Chert?
    Just in advance of the answers, petrified wood is simply organic material that has been mineralogically replaced. There's no reason why chalcedony could not be the replacement mineral... the two descriptions are not mutually exclusive and both could be correct. Wood can be replaced by a variety of minerals given the right conditions.
    I keep six honest serving-men (they taught me all I knew); Their names are What and Why and When and How and Where and Who.

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    • #3
      Roger, I suppose Table Mountain may be correct. if the deposit is in Grand County Colorado. That is what was referred to as a name growing up. It is a small deposit. and the mesa is called tabletop mountain.
      Most deposits  are not huge were I am at. and most of the lithics found are from the area. When you find a imported lithic it is an artifact. even from 30 miles away.
      I have seen a dividing line of less than a mile of one chert source used to another, and yet you do not see either on ether side Yet I have seen lithics found on sites of over 300 miles.
      I guess more to the point is you have chert beds that are sedimentary formed. what makes it a Jasper or a  chalcedony, Quartzite I get from the grain. Obsidian I get from volcanic. Agate? Knife River is a flint? nodgules? Glacial drift? Okay not asking for much. :whistle:
      I understand I think of the deposits themselves of chert from old sea beds of silicon based sand. Since I am just a student. I want to learn.
      And let me first say I will bow down to your Mother at 91, I take my hat off. And I  Respect Those elders that have had a rich life and are still enriching.
      Look to the ground for it holds the past!

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