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  • Incised Stones

    Since I went out of my mind with cabin fever, I have done some intensive research on paleo incised stones.
    I have found that in a lot of digs that there are some incised stones in the paleo layers. Most archeologist have not studied these incised stones and have dismissed them as a tool , that was utilized to dull or grind the edges of paleo projectiles.One good thing is that the stones were kept and on some have been put away in boxes or what have you. Recently, since Gault site digs have produced 11 of the incised stones, they have Been studied more intensely ! And indeed they have found using microscopes that these stone with a few exceptions were not for the purpose of edge grinding... Now, research has started to go back and examine these stones to determine if they are A. Used to dull/ grind the edges of projectiles, or B. What is now considered as Paleo Art artifacts. The latest one that I’ve seen, Willjo found is without question A Paleo Art Artifact !
    I got a decent pic of one from the Gault site, that I display below. These are considered very rare ! Not like cave wall art, but a different type Paleo Art altogeather... JJ
    PS Last two days I’ve been walking/ hunting very intensely and did manage to score a late paleo point , but that is another topic....
    Lubbock County Tx

  • #2
    Man, that would be cool to find. They can't be sharpeners, but by looking at the photo, it don't look pretty enough to be "art". Eh, who knows. So you found a Paleo point? I am in a Paleo mood, so get that topic started, lol!
    "The education of a man is never completed until he dies." Robert E. Lee

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    • Lindenmeier-Man
      Lindenmeier-Man commented
      Editing a comment
      I suppose that art is truly in the eye of the beholder ! If I had that stone I’d most probably gaze upon it a great deal ! Did you notice on the specimen the soil with a flint chip attached ? I’d really like a pic of the stone without the soil covering the rest of the Art ...

    • Kentucky point
      Kentucky point commented
      Editing a comment
      Oh that's dirt! I thought it was a piece of the rock!

  • #3
    The checkerboard or crosshatch pattern is one of the most prevalent geometric patterns across the Americas in the form of petroglyphs. Here's a good two page look at some of the examples from Gault:



    I'm not familiar with these being interpreted as sharpening grooves, actually, although one expects some incised lines were the result of such activity, the more complex geometric designs of the stones at Gault have always been more suggestive of a non utilitarian design.

    Heres a portable petroglyph from Massachusetts with the crosshatch pattern. The material is quartzite.

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    Rhode Island

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    • CMD
      CMD commented
      Editing a comment
      No problem with some being casts. They are exact replicas, after all, and it's the Lithic Casting Lab, so one can buy the casts of many points and other artifacts. Casts allow scientists to study all the originals without having to actually hold the originals. Casts are not a shame at all, IMHO. You can find other info on the Gault site stones using google. For science, at least, casts are important and vital, to allow greater study, and Lithic Casting is among the very best in that regard.

    • Lindenmeier-Man
      Lindenmeier-Man commented
      Editing a comment
      Sir
      I respectfully disagree ..My microscope would be useless in the inspection of any cast, of any artifact...

    • Kentucky point
      Kentucky point commented
      Editing a comment
      See, now that's purdy.

  • #4
    Understand your argument but without context how can you determine the stone found by Wiljo is Paleo? At best an assumption. Pieces like these were only made during the paleo period?
    Searching the fields of NW Indiana and SW Michigan

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    • gregszybala
      gregszybala commented
      Editing a comment
      Now there is the response I expected to a simple question even giving you the benefit of the doubt. You made the claim based on ? But it's the only conclusion left and do my own study? Unless I or a controlled dig by archaeologists, a statement claiming it's so doesn't make it so. Even Hester's page you posted stated items like these were found clear into prehistoric times. I didn't post my comment to argue but to debate the possibility one way or the other based on fact. must be nice to be in Hester's head and know all.

    • Lindenmeier-Man
      Lindenmeier-Man commented
      Editing a comment
      Truly, I don’t need benefit of doubt..I’ve seen all or most of the data on hard stone incision..If you expected the response then you are now in my head.. I do know Hester do you ? As far as I’m concerned this debate is over..Make whatever assumption you wish ... I could care less..!

    • Lindenmeier-Man
      Lindenmeier-Man commented
      Editing a comment
      Greg
      Sir, I must apologize to you for our conflict .. I concede there are no absolutes in reality ..I must say that I myself do believe 100% that Willjo’s stone is paleo Art. At this point please don’t wait until your angry to just say so, on any of my post..We both are seeking truth without inuindo .. I’ve come here to learn and also, to pass on any knowledge that may be applicable ..At the end of the day Sir, my sandbox is always open ! JJ

  • #5
    Originally posted by gregszybala View Post
    Understand your argument but without context how can you determine the stone found by Wiljo is Paleo? At best an assumption. Pieces like these were only made during the paleo period?
    Greg, I saw Wiljo's incised rock on another site, but missed it here. Can you or someone else post a link to his thread? I just searched all 9 pages of "recent posts" with no luck....

    Rhode Island

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    • #6
      Still hoping to see Wiljo's stone again. In the meantime, here are incised crosshatch patterns related to Cahokia....

      Rhode Island

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      • SDhunter
        SDhunter commented
        Editing a comment
        See below Charlie

    • #7
      Charlie, here’s the link.

      Went out yesterday and found this interesting tool yesterday. It just looked like a rock until further inspection. It could be a Scraper, Celt, or adz. it also neat that it has some marks on it. Click image for larger version Name: IMG_0235.JPG Views: 1 Size: 51.5 KB ID: 338946 Click image for larger version
      South Dakota

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      • CMD
        CMD commented
        Editing a comment
        Thanks, Gary. Only just tonight saw this....

    • #8
      These stones are amazing. A good friend of mine got an opportunity a couple years back to go surface hunting on his friends parents property on Buttermilk Creek (this is the Gault Site creek) Salado home of the oldest known human occupation in America. He was about to walk away skunked for the day when he kicked this rock over. He almost didn’t pick it up as most all of the work was obscured in the mud on the stone. When he first wiped the mud off he thought maybe a kid had drawn on this stone. But his friend who allowed him on the property was there with him and recognized the stone for what it is. He informed him on how rare they were and my buddy tried to give it to him. But he wouldn’t take it. He brought over to my place as he knew I would have great interest in such a find and allowed me to photograph it. These are the picts.
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      Central TX

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      • CMD
        CMD commented
        Editing a comment
        Great piece!

    • #9
      It's everyone's best guess as to what this is? But seeing and holding it first hand gave many of us the impression that this is a map or a tally sheet for game in different hunting grounds. There are a million things that people like to keep track of. This is a information of the day. I don't think this is abstract art. What's Y'alls best guess.
      Central TX

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      • KrisRock
        KrisRock commented
        Editing a comment
        This is the equivalent of a modern day SCREEN SHOT.

      • Lindenmeier-Man
        Lindenmeier-Man commented
        Editing a comment
        I hope these stones and debates will encourage more inspection of what is mostly overlooked.. I have no idea of how many artifacts I’ve missed in the last 46 years..Only in the last 20 years or so have I started to pick up almost everything and bring home for closer inspection.

      • KrisRock
        KrisRock commented
        Editing a comment
        They are easily missed, fortunately they are so rare that anyone's chance of even touching one unnoticed is like winning lotto type odds. Touching one and discovering what it is..... Those odds are astronomical.

    • #10
      I agree, but being aware can increase the odds .....
      Lubbock County Tx

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      • #11
        Patterns and Process: Some Thoughts on the Incised Stones from the Gault Site, Central Texas, United States
        D. Clark WERNECKE and Michael B. COLLINS
        *
        Abstract:
        We know of 104 incised stones collected from the Gault Site between 1929 and 2007 from various proveniences and contexts ranging from Early Paleoindian (ca. 13,000-9,000 Cal BP) to Archaic (ca. 9,000-2,000 Cal BP) and perhaps Late Prehistoric (1,200-600 Cal BP). The stones share affinity with incised and painted stones worldwide in traditions dating back at least 90,000 years.Wherever these objects are produced, the end product does not seem to have retained its importance, and, in fact, the process of manufacture and the patterns employed may have been more important than the decorated object after its initial

        Forty one of the original 104 stones have good proveniences ranging from Early Paleoindian (13,600 years ago) to Archaic (9000–1200 years ago). Eight of these so far have been judged to be from good Clovis context (13,500 years ago) and there are a few more from strata we have not yet fully vetted that may also be of Clovis origin. Six of these are of chert and two are very small limestone fragments. Two of the Clovis possibilities still being studied are larger limestone pieces not unlike
        Olmstead‟s original stones. These represent some of the earliest provenienced art in America‟s (Fig. 4).
        Searching the fields of NW Indiana and SW Michigan

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        • #12
          California:
          https://books.google.com/books?id=fF...stones&f=false
          Scroll up to the start on page 274, note the dates.
          Searching the fields of NW Indiana and SW Michigan

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