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Tribal Warfare/ distance traveled

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  • Tribal Warfare/ distance traveled

    I was reading a historical fiction book the other day. Two older N.A. Men were talking about going on a raid that would take them from the mountains of western Pennsylvania to “across the big river to fight the Dakotas”.

    Did long distance raids ever really occur? Could that explain finding a type of point in an area far from its normal range?

    I have a point or two that I found in Illinois, that would look more at home in Texas or New Mexico.
    Fayette County, southern Illinois

  • #2
    I guess it depends on fact or fiction and how old the points you are referring to. My guess is that the super highways of Native Americans "rivers" would lend its self for a expanded area of travel but I don't think it was ever intended to be used for warfare but more for trade. It wasn't until the introduction of european influences and horses did most skirmishes broke out. Most out of desperation of being driven off land they once occupied. Nomadic People would travel in groups but I can only imagine that this was more to follow the games migratory pattern. and on occasion run into another clan. most that were in a closer approximation would do more trading than war like aggression. unless food supply was at minimum amount to sustain life. I do not feel that there was a need or resources to actively search out another clan to make war.
    Just my two cents worth.
    Look to the ground for it holds the past!

    Comment


    • Charles Jones
      Charles Jones commented
      Editing a comment
      Ive read about estimates of pre Colombian population numbers of many millions in the current US lower 48. That number of people competing for resources would seem to cause lots of conflicts and forced migrations.

    • chase
      chase commented
      Editing a comment
      Agree to a point. but how many present day americans are there and even if they number in the millions the food supply was plentiful. The herds of Buffalo when the european influence was incredible. they were also doing agriculture which would lend its self to more of a defined area.

    • chase
      chase commented
      Editing a comment
      I really don't think that a clan would travel hundreds of miles to make war. There was enough to do just surviving there on territory. On the other hand in europe you have a smaller area and it was more prevalent. even in today's society its more greed driven in civil wars and ideology. but in the states you have disagreements and the few nut jobs that go off the deep end but its not the norm to seek out and make war on others.

  • #3
    Well, it's certainly a known historical fact that the Mohawk of the Iroquois Confederacy of upstate NY conducted raids on the Algonquin groups in southern New England. Of course, that's only a few hundred miles round trip for the Mohawk, if raiding those tribes living in eastern New England.
    Rhode Island

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    • #4
      The Pequot are a well known American tribe, living in eastern Ct. But they did not always live there. All we can know is that they arrived from somewhere west of New England, and not in truly ancient times. Instead, it apparently happened not at a great distance in time prior to European colonization. In arriving in their new homeland, the Pequot split the Niantics into two branches, the Western Niantic of eastern coastal Ct., and the Eastern Niantic, of Westerly and Charlestown, RI. Warfare among the local Algonquin groups of southern New England was frequent, but it was not the "total war"(burning to death women, children, and old men) that the English first introduced in the Pequot War of 1637-8. Still, war among the Pequot and Narragansett for control of fishing stations in the boundary areas of the two tribes was periodic, and once Uncas broke off from the Pequot, and formed the Mohegans in the 17th century, war between the Mohegan and Narragansett was also periodic. The English played off tribes that tried to "butter up" to the English, seeing the English as potential powerful allies against rival tribes. In the end, none of this worked out to the tribes' advantage.
      Rhode Island

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      • #5


        maybe not the best source, but other sources contain similar info. Pre historic warfare seems to be wide spread and extremely violent and fatal. Explains why some tribes migrated to different areas.
        Fayette County, southern Illinois

        Comment


        • #6
          According to what I've read, tribal warfare in California was mostly skirmishes between neighbours and remained fairly limited.

          Reasons for violence might be trespassing on territory or trade dispute, or perhaps, just historical animosity

          It's thought that in ancient times tribes conducted battles in open space.

          No doubt these battles were pretty brutal.

          Most likely, opposing warriors would commence with bow and arrow - dodging arrows was a practiced art of war - before advancing to hand-to-hand engagement.

          However, I have read that often these battles could be somewhat ritualized and truces might be called on the death or injury of important figures.

          Other times, massacres might occur.

          Rarely would tribes attack at night and those that did were reviled and feared.

          Only the tribes of the Colorado river are known to have focused their cultures on warfare which, presumably, they conducted against each other and their neighbors.


          This thread asked about long distance raiding and, from what we know, it doesn't seem to have been practiced in California.

          However, there is evidence of mass migrations which are little understood and recognized mostly by language distributions.

          I don't think anybody knows the exact nature and pace of these movements of people or how much violence was involved.

          Maybe it was full scale invasion, maybe incremental assimilation, or maybe something in between.


          On contact with Europeans and in the years that followed, the dynamic changed entirely, traditional models of war were wiped out, along with entire populations, by settlers' efforts to tame, displace or exterminate 'wild indians'.









          California

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          • #7
            For my historic local tribe here in the Piedmont of North and South Carolina during the late 1600's early 1700's there was constant warfare with northern tribes. The Iroquois Seneca and Lenape and many more northern tribes were constantly attacking the Catawba and vice versa. The Catawba were known to chase them all the way back to Pennsylvania and even to New York. In 1762 the great Catawba chief King Haglar was killed by a Shawnee raiding party. Constant Raiding parties took a big toll on the tribe. There are northern creeks and other natural features with Catawba in their names from these raids.
            N.C. from the mountains to the sea

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