Natives and Horses

[CMD]

New insights gained on early use of horses by native groups...

https://www.heritagedaily.com/2021/0...-horses/137049

“It was found in the ground in these geologic deposits from the Pleistocene–the last Ice Age,” said William Taylor, lead author of the new research and a curator of archaeology at the CU Museum of Natural History at the University of Colorado Boulder.

Based on a detailed study of the horse’s bones and DNA, however, Taylor and his colleagues concluded that it wasn’t an Ice Age mammal at all. Instead, the animal was a domesticated horse that had likely belonged to Ute or Shoshone communities before Europeans had a permanent presence in the region.

But Taylor is far from disappointed. He said the animal reveals valuable information about how Indigenous groups in the West looked after their horses.

“This study demonstrates a very sophisticated relationship between Indigenous peoples and horses,” said Taylor, also an assistant professor in the Department of Anthropology. “It also tells us that there might be a lot more important clues to the human-horse story contained in the horse bones that are out there in libraries and museum collections.”

[south fork]

I have buried a few and takes a big hole but I used a backhoe . I would guess the horse in question got stuck in the mud ? A lot of meat was wasted not being butchered .

[Mattern]

Good read CMD!

[Cecilia]

And thank you, SouthFork, for domestic nutritional reflections! I was just yelling’ at Daughter this morning about how much food she buys, cooks, wastes. But re post, own reflections are:

-yep, agree backhoe a must; burying horse is just about one of hardest things done...put it right up there natural childbirth😉 (plus, backhoe rental more ‘n $250)

-also, since People same brains, hearts as us, maybe had alternative food sources, and didn’t wanna eat beloved Friend and/or good and faithful Servant (some of the People buried dogs that had not been main course)

- but biggest reflection is : Aha, knew it! The People weren’t provided initial horses by Europeans! They already had them! ...now, must go research CMD’s topic further…. This very exciting! (Brain just flashed North America’s very own version hotblood like eastern People’s Arabians, or version coldblood like ancient Icelandic ...imagination now galloping! Thank you, once again, CMD!)

[CMD]

No, Europeans did introduce the horse to Native Americans. There just were no European settlements in that area when they had horses. The horse originated in the Americas, as a very small mammal, in the Eocene Period, about 50 million years ago, and evolved, in the Americas, to the species we know today. But they became extinct in the Americas before they were reintroduced by Europeans. They would have still been present during Paleo times, but crossed into Asia and disappeared from the Americas.....

[Cecilia]

Shoot. Many yrs ago, always, always reading about horses, including their evolution, and remember little forerunner horsette gone extinct in general area what is now Florida. But, thot maybe science discovered new info... For very long time, avoided subject of horses in any capacity, including averting eyes if even passed one in pasture.

The Horse-Human relationship is astounding; I think we should pause to try to imagine what mankind and his culture would have been like if horses never existed....

[paohrocks]

Interesting read.

[Cecilia]

CMD, time to clean out pm boxes

[tomf]

It hard to over estimate the impact the reintroduction of horses had on the people of the plains and southwest.
An overnight transformation from walking people to mounted. Suddenly the horizon changes. Quickly the culture and lifestyle adapts. The reward is huge as hunting opportunities massively increase. So does friction between peoples.
I think maybe the way the people were able to develop such a strong relationship with horses so quickly reflects their empathy for nature.
We know how much they prized their horses, the best of which were status symbols for headman and chief.
I read of a Cheyenne Chief who was buried mounted upright on his favorite steed. That's a deep hole to dig.

[Cecilia]

And no backhoes back then! ( ....I can make light of darkest subject only now, almost 10 yrs after death of my beloved Buchephalus ....)

[south fork]

We had horses for a long time did a lot of trail riding and endurance riding mostly 50 mile rides . I took a first place heavy weight me not the horse lol on a 50 mile ride out in the Great Basin Nevada .

[painshill]

I would refer you to “Horses in America” in our Information Centre:

https://forums.arrowheads.com/forum/...ses-in-america

[ApacheNDN]

I watched an interesting documentary recently concerning the Comanche tribe, Numunu, concerning the horse. They were at one time the " Lords of the Plains" due to their adeptness of not only their riding and breeding abilities, but their complete control of the horse trade across most of the great plains. According to the historians that during their time of power if you had a horse in that part of America, you got it from a Comanche. in one way or the other. I also read that one of the greatest tribes for care and breeding, and still are, are the Nez Perce. They are, from what I understand, are responsible for the Appaloosa breed. I know from what I was taught by my elders was that the first time they saw Europeans on horses was that they were in awe, and that what a great thing this was. You could use it to travel and a meal in one.

[Garguy]

Another interesting thing is the men riding horses painted on that cliff face 12000 years ago.

[Pointblank]

Which cliff face is that at Steve?

[Ron Kelley]

Interesting point Steve. Most bones decay very quickly or are eaten by other animals. Who covered North Central and South America to say that the horse went extinct? Surely the numbers greatly declined. How do we know if the horse went extinct or simply migrated to a more suitable climate. We know that the Elk migrated great distances. Even today the Caribou make some long migrations.

[Garguy]

That huge cliff in Colombia