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New Museum - Turtle Shell Artifact

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  • #16
    Found this in a Southern Illinois field years ago. Always thought it was just an old neat looking turtle shell until I saw the post from Mmerc and the responses. Please forgive the multiple posts as I had a tough time getting the pics up.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by BabaORiley; 11-17-2015, 06:22 AM.
    The chase is better than the catch...
    I'm Frank and I'm from the flatlands of N'Eastern Illinois...

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    • #17
      Heres a couple more.
      Attached Files
      Last edited by BabaORiley; 11-17-2015, 06:22 AM.
      The chase is better than the catch...
      I'm Frank and I'm from the flatlands of N'Eastern Illinois...

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      • #18
        You can see the holes are almost exactly the same.
        Attached Files
        Last edited by BabaORiley; 11-17-2015, 06:24 AM.
        The chase is better than the catch...
        I'm Frank and I'm from the flatlands of N'Eastern Illinois...

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        • #19
          Very interesting. Thanks for posting.

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          • #20
            Intriguing, isn’t it? What we have is a certainty that the holes were man-made (and crudely so) but only a circumstantial connection to use for a perpendicular-handled rattle in that the hole placements are consistent with that. I don’t buy into them being “tethering” holes.

            Turtles held ritual significance for some Native American groups, in part from creation myths that the world was formed on a turtle’s back, and some Native American groups did not eat box turtles because of those beliefs. Turtle shell rattles appear throughout ethnographic and ethnohistoric accounts from the Southeastern United States and up into Canada, and continue to be used today by groups including, but not limited to, the Cherokee, Shawnee, Muscogee, and Seminole. They are found at sites dating from the Archaic period (ca. 8000-1000 BC) into the Historic period (ca. AD 1450 – present), and are particularly well represented in Mississippian assemblages (ca. AD 1000-1450).

            During the Mississippian period, people wore rattles on their upper arm or lower leg and the majority of rattles from Mississippian contexts are found in burials or ritual deposits. They are also typically found with younger females or older males, although this is not exclusive. Mississippian rattles have three to five holes drilled into the shell in order to tie the shell to the arm or leg. Historic and modern rattles may have as many as 20-25 holes drilled into the shell, which allows for the pebbles that are rattling inside the shell to reverberate. [ref: “Shake it like a Turtle Shell Rattle” by Andrew Gillreath-Brown, University of North Texas].

            It would also be fair to say that there has been a relatively modern trend for tribes without any particular heritage of use to adopt such rattles as an iconic item (pretty much as for “dreamcatchers”). That has also fostered their sale as “souvenir” items from the reservation period onwards and if you check the web there are loads of people selling them today (and offering DIY project plans to make them) as “art”.

            I don’t think we have any way to confirm the age (or the possibility of “authentic” use) of either of these finds (or the third one that I posted), except to speculate based on the circumstances of the recovery and the condition of the shell.
            I keep six honest serving-men (they taught me all I knew); Their names are What and Why and When and How and Where and Who.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Mmerc20 View Post
              I'm not sure if this is an artifact but I haven't gotten a straight answer yet. I personally found this little box turtle shell in the middle of the woods near a stream but not any civilization, or any I could see on historic maps. It has two holes drilled in the back side and some internal scraping marks but nothing else to note. I assumed if they were bite marks from a predator, there would be cracking around the holes so that's why I think they were drilled. Any clue?
              Reviving an old thread because I just found a similar box turtle shell. Only reason I picked it up was because I've been going through old posts trying to learn as much as possible and saw this post awhile back.

              I was going down a small river with no luck and came to this small creek joining the river. At the mouth, found a few performs and a couple uniface tools. Go up the creek and it is loaded with worked flint, no points but didn't have much time as I had to get going.

              Did find this turtle shell with the two holes in it in the little creek.

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              • #22
                Hi, I am a herpetologist and I specialize in turtles. These are wear holes caused over time by movement of the hips/pelvis. A lot of fully mature turtles demonstrate this condition. So far we have seen it in tortoises, box turtles, musk turtles and in the shoulder portion of soft shell turtles. If the femurs were still attached you'd see how they line up exactly to the configuration and size of the holes.
                For 15 years I was the collections manager at the Amphibian and Reptile Diversity Research Center at UT Arlington. I was able to review hundreds of turtle shells and their affiliated bones.

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                • redrocks
                  redrocks commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Interesting Carl...good input!

                • clovisoid
                  clovisoid commented
                  Editing a comment
                  That's cool.

                  My roommate my freshman year in college had a very similar role to you at the University of New Mexico. (That has to be a relatively small world, know a guy with a long last name that ends in ski?)
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