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Monolithic Axe Slave killer?

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  • Monolithic Axe Slave killer?

    Hi. New member here. I recently acquired this item at an estate auction. It has no history. The auctioneer just called it whale tooth looking thing lol. I'm not sure if it would be possible for ancient people to carve that fine of a cut between the two axe heads? Its very smooth and shiny but my google searches show that a lot of these types of items were smooth..

    I was wondering if there is any chance it could be a real and not a modern reproduction?

    It is broken off on one end so it has one thing going for it.

    If there is a chance its real whom would be a good person or place to authenticate it?

    Here is a google drive link with some hi res photos.






  • #2
    Yeah, that Title might not go over real well.
    http://joshinmo.weebly.com

    Comment


    • #3
      I have handled two authentic monolithic " slave killer "axes over the years. The term slave killer was put on these a long time ago. There isn't any proof they were used for such a purpose. Anyway, there's a lot that could be said about these. There are so many repros of these, probably only one out of the next 1000 I would handle might be real. So, I looked at the photos. It's a reproduction. The type material is wrong for the type artifact. It looks like polished serpentine, and the polish is from machine buffing. It should be polished basalt, or sometimes these are made from limestone, but rarely. They are normally only found in a cremated context, and this one doesn't show any signs of even being in the ground. The two lobes are to close together, they're never carved in the middle of the " club ", and it has way to high of a polish. The photos aren't close up enough to see the real details of the surface, but going mostly on typology, the form, shape, type stone, and style are incorrect. Symmetry actually comes into play on these. The small diminutive head with ears, which is missing on this one, actually has to be made on a correct angle to the long handle axis, and the lobes are the same thing. They are carved with a space between and are at a given angle to the handle. The only other person I know who could identify this from the photos, would be a friend from Washington state who specializes in collecting these type artifacts, but I wouldn't give his name or email out without his permission. But I already know he would tell you the same thing I just did. Sorry, I wish it was authentic!! If it was, I could give you so many details from my research on these, it would take two pages to write it all, including the ones found on Gunther Island. There was a short discussion on these I think back in 2010 here on the forum about the last authentic one I had. This was about the first authentic I had acquired, and had one other since. I spent days researching these, because I never thought I would have a chance to actually handle an authentic axe of this type. I think the name slave killer should be dropped.
      Last edited by pkfrey; 08-24-2018, 03:00 PM.
      http://www.ravensrelics.com/

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      • Tam
        Tam commented
        Editing a comment
        Very nice Paul

      • pkfrey
        pkfrey commented
        Editing a comment
        I'll just add one more very important piece of information on these. If you, or anyone sees one of these, it MUST come with collector history, and verifiable provenance. There are certain names attached to these who found them, especially H.H. Stuart and T.J. Hannah. And Kroeber. There's probably less than 100 authentic examples of these known to exist, including private collections and institutions combined. So, if you see one at an auction, and there isn't any reference to Gunther Island, or a northwest site, with one of these names, I would guarantee it's a reproduction.

    • #4
      Welcome to the Ah.com forum Longbow!

      Sorry about that, hope you didn't have to much in it... Lots of tough lessons to learn when buying artifacts. I've had a few oopsies, the best defense is educating yourself and staying within your knowledge base if you do like to purchase any collectables really. Mononlithic axes are like hens teeth and I think you got a real good evaluation from PkFrey. I'm glad he's around to share his knowledge with folks on this forum.
      Josh (Ky/Tn collector)

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      • #5
        Sorry Longbowdude. I wasn't aware there is Something with such a name and It was Your first Topic and that had Me thinking which doesn't always go well either.
        http://joshinmo.weebly.com

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        • #6
          Hey no sweat. Thanks for all the info. I dont have much money in this item so no worrys on that.

          I took a knife to it and it carves easily and seems to be made out of what I would call soapstone.

          Comment


          • #7
            It probably is. When soapstone is machine buffed and takes on that high of polish, it can resemble serpentine, which is a softer relative of soapstone. This is a give away in itself, these effigy axes weren't made of soapstone. This is all good, because now you know not to bid to high if you see another similar one.
            http://www.ravensrelics.com/

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            • #8
              Well done. I learned as well. Thanks for the knowledge.

              Comment


              • #9
                There's a monolithic axe coming up in T & T Auctions on Sept. 29th. That one actually looks authentic, if you want to see what they should like and some details. The two lobes are spaced correctly and polished to an edge. These are what does the damage for it's purpose. The entire upper length is curved on the correct angle to the handle, and the head is very important. It's diminutive and believed to be a wold head. The material is correct, basalt. And has excellent provenance. Just letting folks know in case you run into one, this is what they usually look like. Wait and see what it goes for. I'm sure the specialists are checking this one out. I'll have to let my buddy know from Wash., he would be interested, but can tell from the photos if it's good or not.
                http://www.ravensrelics.com/

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                • #10
                  I was just going through some of my stuff and remembered this item.

                  I was about to toss it in the trash but something is nagging at me about it. Logically I cant see why somebody with enough knowledge to know about these types of axes would bother to make a fake one and make it so off from what it should be. Wrong material, Wrong shape and spacing of the axe tines and so on.. and then break the handle off to make it seem even older. It just does not follow human behavior logic to me. I would think a faker or repro maker would at least try and make it look similar to the photos of ones that have already been found and make it from the correct material.

                  Is it possible it could be something else not found before from a different area? Is there any labs out there that do scientific tests on items like this? I would gladly have it sent out and pay a small fee for some type of test just to set my mind at ease on it.

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                  • #11
                    I see the PK Frey says this looks like Serpintine to him but that was bothering me. I have seen soapstone like this before on modern pieces. It is soft but has those harder spots in it. The hard spots I mention are those raised areas. When trying to smooth and finish the surface the hard spots did not polish down as well as the surrounding areas. This Soapstone was mined in Virgina and is of very poor quality . It was below the surface of what the ancients were utilizing. . The mines in VA do have some great quality material but they also have this junk which was sold and used in stacking rock for fireplaces. As for the damage the carver may have dropped it accidentally during manufacture or may have purposly broke it just so it looks like it had been damaged in the field. Perhaps trying to make it look like plow damage. The only mine for Soapstone in the US is in Nelson Co VA. almost a million tons of soapstone has come out of there since the late 1800's . I am told this type you are showing is of a poor grade and was no where near the surface. It would have been impossible for the ancients to get at this stuff as it was mined from deep in the quarry with modern equipment.
                    TN formerly CT Visit our store http://stores.arrowheads.com/store.p...m-Trading-Post

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                    • pkfrey
                      pkfrey commented
                      Editing a comment
                      Hoss, I only said it looks like serpentine in the beginning of the discussion. After longbow said he cut it with a knife, no doubt I would change my mind and call it soapstone. To answer longbows question of why someone would go to the trouble of making one of these, if it would get by and thought to be authentic, it's value would between $8K - $12K dollars!! But the maker didn't know what the typology of an authentic one should be, so he just made it to conform to as close as he thought it should be. For maybe less than two days work, look at the profit he was trying to get. But of course maybe the person who made this, just wanted to do it for the fun of it and not trying to deceive anyone.

                    • Hoss
                      Hoss commented
                      Editing a comment
                      You make a good point Paul.
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