Possible Kirk or Bolen

[Seltzer Boy]

Here's an interesting one from central FL. I think it's a kirk or a bolen. A left side bevel is present and becomes more prominent at the distal end, giving it a slightly twisted look. I can't tell if the base is intentional. Are there some where a "snapped" base served a purpose? Thanks and enjoy!

[Hal Gorges]

👍

[Seltzer Boy]

I saw that page but was skeptical. Is it a real type?

[Hal Gorges]

Collector type..read headline.

[beatup1354]

Interesting point type

[Frogpoint]

I'd go with a kirk with a broken base also!

[redrocks]

Snapped base is a broad subject...if it was broken during use....a lot more than the base would have broke...I can't pick up a point and snap it..no way...that's probably how it was made

[sailorjoe]

Hi Frogpoint. I think you are wrong in believing that your point is broken. I think you found a Kirk but my fairly strong opinion is that the so-called "Snapped Base" can be considered a genuine type. The reason I believe so is, although I no longer hunt or collect actively, back in the day I found 44 Kirks in the Tenn. Valley area in north Alabama. Of those 44, 16 were Corner Notch, 4 were Stemmed, 4 were Serrated/Sttemmed and 16 were Snapped Base. Kirks were nearly always used as points for knives. Kirks because of their old age frequently have a fairly heavy patina. The patina on the base was the same as the patina on the sides. When knives are broken they always or nearly always break at the tips unless they get broken by a farmers plow or some such recent activity. Sometimes they get broken during manufacture and never finished. And sometimes during use they could be broken in half. When some folks see points with broken tips then by falsely thinking all points are projectile points then those "arrowheads" or spear points sustained "impact" fractures. It is still surprising to me that so many of our forum members still think this way. But the forum sometimes is like school. There is a new class of 1st graders every year. HST, then back to the subject of the stem of your point. What seems obvious to me is that the bases were purposefully not thinned as are the stems on most types of points. Also, it seems like it should have to do with the way they were halfted to the handle. I do not make primitive weapons or tools. Some people do this as a hobby (i.e. make arrows, bows, knives, etc.) Some of our members do that so maybe they would be able to contribute to this part of my discussion as I know next to nothing about making primitive weapons. But it seems to me that corner notched and side notched points may be halfted different than stemless points or points with very short unthinned stems (snapped). To me it is not logical to think that a knife would break where it was halfted. Steel knifes that we use today almost never break at that location. I've broken a few knives in my day by heavy or improper use and never had one to break there. It is also not logical to me to think that they would continue to make a point that was so weak in that area and continue to do so for hundreds of years or more. With 36% of my Kirks this way, then I could not think otherwise. So yes, I think you have a Kirk Snapped Base whether or not it is recognized as a type. It was made that way from the "git-go". By the way another Early Archaic type that I had a good many of is the Big Sandy. I found 55 of them and not one of them were broken at or near the halfting area.

[sailorjoe]

You are most welcome Seltzer Boy. I apologize for not addressing this to you in my opening. I had you and Frogpoint on my mind because of what he thought he would call one he found. Should've said Hi Seltzer Boy and then went fo Fp. There is a lot to learn as I continue to do. And sometimes what we learn is changed via new research. I've found archeologists and amateurs to sometimes be somewhat inflexible when it comes to changing their minds once they're committed to a certain dogma. Just consider the "Clovis first" hypothesis that so many believed for so long.

[Seltzer Boy]

No worries. good info 👍

[WAH]

Excellent explanation, well done

[Frogpoint]

Thanks for the info I have always heard people going back and forth between being broken and made that way originally I appreciate the information!

[tomclark]

Kirk Serrated Broken Base - a known "type" by Tom the Lumper

[Seltzer Boy]

I like the snapped base type argument. but i could also picture an oblique strike to the face breaking a point clean right where the hafting support ends. Who knows

[Tam]

This is my kind of learning thread . Thanks for the input