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  • A question.

    How do y'all feel about using ancient cores to spall from, and how do you feel about knapping ancient spall and flakes? Does it say your decision, if there is use wear or flaking from resharpening on the flakes and spalls?
    Stagger Lee/ SE Missouri

  • #2
    I’m not sure I understand the question Andrew....

    Comment


    • #3
      I don't knap, but when I hear people use old cores and discarded artifacts to make new pieces...it always seems like they are destroying a piece of history to me. I know this won't be a popular option on here, but it's just my thoughts. It doesn't get me in an uproar, I just don't think I would do it if I made modern pieces.

      Comment


      • Lindenmeier-Man
        Lindenmeier-Man commented
        Editing a comment
        I think you clarified the Q for me... I guess I couldn’t understand reworking a artifact...Or I couldn’t fathom doing it, and couldn’t imagine reworking a artifact...A blank area of my mind ....

      • flintguy
        flintguy commented
        Editing a comment
        I agree, just seems like there are plenty of natural stones out there, why rework something that has been worked by ancient man thousands of years ago. There are only so many of those artifacts around, a finite number.

    • #4
      It's a personal decision to be made by the owner of the rock. I would never rechip an ancient point. Flake knives with good secondary flaking are some of my favorite artifacts. I have purchased many pounds of ancient spalls from rock dealers and I knap them. Waste flakes are the majority of ancient artifacts and I have no problem using them. When I knap a big knife I get hundreds of waste flakes: Just consider the ratio. Some people seem to think that every waste flake is a tool and that simply is not true. In the following picture you see many ancient Hornstone spalls: They are artifacts and I knapped them into some of my favorite knives and points.

      Click image for larger version

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      Michigan Yooper
      If You Don’t Stand for Something, You’ll Fall for Anything

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      • #5
        I think that most of you have seen my 85 pound Hornstone core. I purchased that nodule to knap but when it arrived I decided to keep it intact. The 85 pound core came from the same rock dealer as the ancient spalls pictured above.

        Click image for larger version

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        Michigan Yooper
        If You Don’t Stand for Something, You’ll Fall for Anything

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        • #6
          This is a Hornstone nodule that was split in half in ancient times. Spalls were removed in ancient times. It was an ancient artifact and I knapped many points and knives from this one.
          Click image for larger version  Name:	Core 2a.gif Views:	0 Size:	2.12 MB ID:	416309

          Here are a couple of the big Agate Basin style blades I knapped from this core:

          Click image for larger version

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          Last edited by Ron Kelley; 01-12-2020, 01:11 PM.
          Michigan Yooper
          If You Don’t Stand for Something, You’ll Fall for Anything

          Comment


          • #7
            It's personal choice, and if you have a relatively strong opinion either way it's an easy to topic for people to get bent out of shape over.

            In my personal opinion, ancient is good, modern is good, modern made from ancient is less good.

            Ron posted some great examples. The last piece is a great knapping candidate in my eye, a split nodule that was discarded for some reason. I've knapped hundreds of pieces like that. But a couple of the items in the first picture might be too "artifacty" for my knapping tastes. I probably wouldn't have collected them as artifacts, but I wouldn't have repurposed them.

            In my opinion commercial rock dealers can do a lot more damage to the archaeological record than either collectors or knappers. They can take an ancient quarry and associated relics down to bedrock and a million modern spalls faster than you can believe. (Any old bifaces and relics are gone, anything left is contaminated with flakes and spalls from dealers who need to travel with portable bifaces and spalls vs raw rock.)

            Comment


            • #8
              I sent Ron some waste flakes from a field I hunted. I felt it would be special to make a point from a waste flake that was once handle by a Native American. I felt like it was saving that flake. It was just a piece of flint in a box. Now it’s a beautiful point from a piece of flint that was in a box. I think it made that modern point a little more special. That’s how I felt anyway. Not saying the other opinions are wrong. Like Joshua said, I think personal opinion is what matters. No real right or wrong.
              My name is Gary. I live in NE South Dakota

              Comment


              • Ron Kelley
                Ron Kelley commented
                Editing a comment
                Thanks Gary, I have said it before: I feel a special connection with the Ancients when I knap a point from one of their waste flakes. I put extra effort into knapping a flake that was handled by the Ancients. Many times I try to leave a bit of the ancient patina on the modern point. Knapping your Knife River Flint flakes was something I will always treasure.
                Last edited by Ron Kelley; 01-13-2020, 10:18 AM.

              • Ron Kelley
                Ron Kelley commented
                Editing a comment
                Hey Gary, The beautiful quartzite rocks you sent me were not used by the Ancients but were collected by the Ancients: I think that makes them ancient artifacts. I will be working those rocks for a long time to come. That Yellow/Orange quartzite is the most beautiful of quartzites.
                Last edited by Ron Kelley; 01-12-2020, 11:25 PM.

              • SDhunter
                SDhunter commented
                Editing a comment
                I’m glad you are making use of them

            • #9
              When I knapped this ancient spall I noticed that the patina was a lot lighter colored than the rock underneath. I intentionally left a small bit of the lighter colored patina on the blade to remind me that this is a special point knapped from an ancient spall.
              Click image for larger version

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              Michigan Yooper
              If You Don’t Stand for Something, You’ll Fall for Anything

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              • #10
                Those agate basins are super. Made out of anything are great. I have no opinion on the question, your rocks.

                Comment


                • #11
                  Thanks for the feedback y'all.
                  Stagger Lee/ SE Missouri

                  Comment


                  • Ron Kelley
                    Ron Kelley commented
                    Editing a comment
                    Hey Andrew, Something that may give you a clearer picture of opinions: Seventeen different Arrowheads.com members have sent me ancient spalls and waste flakes to knap.

                • #12
                  Here’s what I did with all my artifacts, flint, tools, hammer stones, broken points. I had over 100 lbsof flakes from just one site. I’ve been adding over time this is my mother’s yard. https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=...&v=csXepqKMfos

                  Comment


                  • #13
                    I can see some feelings being hurt in the question but to me it's up to the person. I really don't have a thought on it except that. So knap away if you like or save them if you want. Either way keep posting I like looking at the artwork you guys make.

                    Comment

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