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  • Remember This?

    http://www.nbcnews.com/id/43495434/n...t#.Uk7tpTK9KSM
    Well, look at what the finder of this precious rarity just wrote on another forum:
    "The worst part was the wait Mr --, I knew the thing was real but I had to wait on 150 archaeologists among every other type of sientist from all 4 corners of our planet to say it was. it went threw every test and scan known to modern man and then some to make sure it was real and passed them all.the unbelievable part is the jealousy there have been so many poo talkers about my find that know nothing other than they just wish it was theirs, to them Iv one thing to say(CARMA IS A B***H) the funny thing is it sat under my sink for years in a box with a dozen other bone frags I found that day. a splash of water and just the right lighting was the only reason I noticed the engraving. those who only see the pictures don't realize how faint the engraving is. the awesome photographer at the Smithsonian is the reason its even noticeable same with the copy at gainsville that also was made by the people at the Smithsonian it had to be emphasized so it could be seen. now Im gona share something very very few other than scientists involved know, there is another carved bone I found that dwarfs the other. But Iv decided to handle this one myself I refuse to go threw that hell again. its for sale also and I don't care whos feelings it hurts. Scott Wolter is coming to my home on the 8th to film a show with me for history channel, you may know it its called America Unearthed after that Im selling this one to the highest bidder. I have a genuine love for history but I have a slightly greater love for piece of mind."
    Man, that is sad. Not only does science apparently not get to examine it, but the finder is turning to a scholar fond of sensationalistic claims.
    Rhode Island

  • #2
    What’s really sad is that the find context and stratigraphy has never been established for the Vero bone because Kennedy couldn’t remember exactly where and when he found it and up to three years elapsed between the find and the discovery of the engraving. While there is no reason to doubt Kennedy’s account, it was said at the time that what was really needed was another find in context. If Kennedy has made a second find, it would be crucially important to researchers – especially if he can provide more context than was possible for the first find.
    British Ice Age art expert Paul Bahn had previously examined the artefact and urged researchers to clean, re-examine and catalogue every item recovered from the Vero Man site since its discovery in 1913: “It's important to go back to the old material from the site and check it out because if you have one from here, there will be more.” Experience suggests that items from sites in Europe have previously been overlooked and placed in storage because people weren’t looking for things they didn't know existed. The possibility of Ice Age art wasn’t even accepted by European archaeologists until the end of the 19th Century”.
    I keep six honest serving-men (they taught me all I knew); Their names are What and Why and When and How and Where and Who.

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    • #3
      No pics?
        ..........

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      • #4
        If yall only knew how screwed up the state of Florida is you might begin to understand!!!

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        • #5
          The first find is mentioned on our original thread here:

          http://forums.arrowheads.com/forum/g...oth-in-america

          The engraved bone is pictured there (and also in the link to the NBC article on this thread). If you mean pictures of the second find then it looks like Kennedy is keeping his powder dry so that the TV programme gets an "exclusive".

          Maybe "first" and "second" are not the right terms. Fragments of tusk (pictured left below) and bird bone (pictured right) with possible man-made engravings were excavated in 1915 by Elias Sellards during the original field work at the Vero Man site.


          Unfortunately, all we have are the drawings (there are no photographs as far as I am aware) and the current whereabouts of these items (if they still exist) is not known. If anyone knows different, I would appreciate the information.

          Incidentally, the Smithsonian’s official position on the first find by Kennedy is interesting. Dennis Stanford went into print with: “While we see no evidence that it is a forgery… the institution doesn’t authenticate objects unless they are donated to the museum.” Stanford feels entitled to say more than that outside of his capacity at the Smithsonian but the official position hasn't changed since the investigative work of 2011, I believe.
          I keep six honest serving-men (they taught me all I knew); Their names are What and Why and When and How and Where and Who.

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          • #6
            eagle eye wrote:

            No pics?
              Roger's right.  We'll have to wait for the episode of America Unearthed in question. I doubt the finder will post any photos on the net just yet...
            Rhode Island

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            • #7
              Yes, I wish I had found it. :woohoo:
              That being said....  If it was found, even as a fossil, on any state lands or waters........ :whistle:  inch:
              Due to FL regulation interpretation, better not to remember...?!?!?!?!?????? hmy:   He can't say if it was found at the Vero Man Site or anywhere on the Main Relief Channel in Vero...  If it was, the state would take it for sure.  I assume it was private property.  Sell it quick, LOL.
              Professor Shellman
              Tampa Bay

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              • #8
                Nope, don't sell it because then someone would be selling or buying stolen property!
                A sale in this case would first require exact provenience. Then it would be established whether the item could be sold or not!

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                • #9
                  :huh:
                    ..........

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                  • #10
                    Dr. Barbara Purdy,University of Florida Archeologist examined it and likes it.Hear she talks a little about the Vero site
                    http://youtu.be/bh0B61tvcUo

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                    • #11
                      Bill wrote:

                      Nope, don't sell it because then someone would be selling or buying stolen property!
                      A sale in this case would first require exact provenience. Then it would be established whether the item could be sold or not!
                        Are you sure about that, Bill? Why would he need to provide an exact find location before selling it? Sounds like Wolter will film it and the finder for "America Unearthed". One would think Wolter's first question, anybody's first question, would be "where did you find it?" Maybe the finder's answer will open a box he would prefer to keep shut if he wants to sell it after it's been featured on that show? Not doubting you as such, just seeking clarification. Is there a Florida law that would make the sale illegal if the exact find location is listed as "unknown"?
                      Rhode Island

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                      • #12
                        A little background on the finder. Also a drawing of one of the most famous American mammoth carving fakes- the Holly Oak Pendant.
                        http://app1.kuhf.org/mobile/npr1311586400

                        And another fake mammoth carving, the Lenape Stone:
                        http://www.lordwhimsy.com/the-lenape-stone
                        http://abob.libs.uga.edu/bobk/lstone_a.html


                        Rhode Island

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                        • #13
                          Yep I am sure CMD and here's why. If the artifact in question was found below the water line in Florida, then it already belongs to the State of Florida!
                          Unless it can be covered under a "grandfather clause", then the finder cannot sell something that does not belong to him. Without knowing this first than everything else is moot.
                          If I were the finder, then the first thing I would do before selling the thing, is to see where my legal rights are.
                          There are already some Florida and Georgia folks who have learned that the hard way! Because as of now, it is no longer legal to hunt for and keep artifacts found in Florida rivers.
                          As Tom posted, He can't say if it was found at the Vero Man Site or anywhere on the Main Relief Channel in Vero... If it was, the state would take it for sure.

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                          • #14
                            Collecting fossils on state land/rivers is not illegal in the state of Florida but you do however have to apply for a permit in order to collect vertebrate fossils,it's a fairly simple process and only cost $5.00.http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/vertpaleo/vppermit.htm
                            But it is illegal to sale any vertebrate fossils found on state land http://www.flmnh.ufl.edu/vertpaleo/FS1004.576.htm
                            His is a unique situation.Is it considered a fossil or artifact or both? :unsure: What a quandary for the poor fella!!! :S

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                            • #15
                              Thanks, guys. I guess if there are scientists who have seen it and he made statements to them as to where it was found, he would have a problem if he tried to sell it. Yet, the state is not making an effort to seize it from him, are they? He has it in his possession in a safe place, or even under his bed for all I know. If it does not belong to him to sell, why is he allowed to keep it at all? Sounds like the state would be content for him to own it, but would not let him transfer ownership to another private party? Just doesn't make any sense to me. Why isn't the state demanding the return of this fossil/artifact? Why can they stop it's sale, but not just claim it right now? If he has given statements to witnesses that he found it in state waters or on state land, then why no effort to take it away from him?
                              Rhode Island

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