This is a must read topic!!!!!!!

[grombiz]

I have a place I dig from time to time and its always produced a great number of arrowheads for me. I came across this spot walking the creek one day, as I was walking i discovered what look to be burn rock, then I started to notice a significant amount of flint just sitting on top of the ground and I mean alot of flint. I knew I was onto something great already but it gets even better, as I began to explore further I realize that the fire-rock and the large amount of flint almost seemed as if it would never stop. What I had stumbled across was a mound/midden that was by far the larges I have ever seen or even heard about. This field next to this creek was holding an area of burn-rock 100x100 yards.With more flint on top of the ground, then pulled out of the ground from other mounds/midden I have dug. I knew I had come across a huge midden that most people can only dream about. I've also kept this spot a secret, I'm the only one that knows of this area. This is what I need help with! The old man that owned the land passed away and now the kids are selling the the land, which will be destroy and houses will mostly be built. It doesn't seem right to me to just let all that history just get destroyed. I'm guessing there's thousands upon thousand of arrowhead here, maybe tens of thousands who knows. How would I go about getting this place looked at by a university or something of that nature, to come out and start a dig. There's so much history in this field and it would be a shame to lose all of it, expectantly with a midden of this size. There's no telling what might come out of that midden. Please help me with any info that might help me stop this large amount of history from being destroyed.

[twiasp]

Try and buy a small section of the land and offer well more per acre for some of the land than he wants for it, may coerce him to split the land up and your site will not be touched. /shrug Even if he sells it with the economy and such it will probably take a while to sell it and then get developed. A land developer probably doesn't care about a tiny acre or two when he is buying massive amounts, if he gets the land anyways buy the land from him as a future home land owner lol.

[grombiz]

twiasp wrote:

Try and buy a small section of the land and offer well more per acre for some of the land than he wants for it, may coerce him to split the land up and your site will not be touched. /shrug Even if he sells it with the economy and such it will probably take a while to sell it and then get developed. A land developer probably doesn't care about a tiny acre or two when he is buying massive amounts, if he gets the land anyways buy the land from him as a future home land owner lol.

  Hey Twiasp, I'm fresh out of college and its not looking good right now. I should of just drop out and saved the money. With this economy my 4 year degree can barely get me a job flipping burgers. Buying that land is not in the cards for me right now. I must say you do have a great idea, so this is what came to mind when I read your post. If you're liquid for that kind of investment, maybe you could be an investor. We could make you're wise investment into a vary profitable business without even trying. Just make it into a pay dig site,a mound/midden of this size would produce a small fortune,if you did that. Wow, why didn't I think of this before. If you buy it, I'll build it and they will come! Not only would it be a great investment, your saving a great piece of American history, that otherwise would be forever lost. Doing something you love and making a small fortune doing it. Well... That only happen to most people when they go to sleep. If you're tired of working for your money, maybe you should try letting your money work for you. Just an idea, let me know what you think.

[twiasp]

I'm definately not interested in buying land that far away from me, sorry. Seems like it would be a very bad investment on my part, but a good one for you. Don't see the silver lining in it for me and people wouldn't pay to dig points they would just come on the property uninvited since I would not be there to shoot them. Was just offering advice, am in no way thinking of using my own money. I was just helping you brainstorm ideas.

[grombiz]

I have a place I dig from time to time and its always produced a great number of arrowheads for me. I came across this spot walking the creek one day, as I was walking i discovered what look to be burn rock, then I started to notice a significant amount of flint just sitting on top of the ground and I mean alot of flint. I knew I was onto something great already but it gets even better, as I began to explore further I realize that the fire-rock and the large amount of flint almost seemed as if it would never stop. What I had stumbled across was a mound/midden that was by far the larges I have ever seen or even heard about. This field next to this creek was holding an area of burn-rock 100x100 yards.With more flint on top of the ground, then pulled out of the ground from other mounds/midden I have dug. I knew I had come across a huge midden that most people can only dream about. I've also kept this spot a secret, I'm the only one that knows of this area. This is what I need help with! The old man that owned the land passed away and now the kids are selling the the land, which will be destroy and houses will mostly be built. It doesn't seem right to me to just let all that history just get destroyed. I'm guessing there's thousands upon thousand of arrowhead here, maybe tens of thousands who knows. How would I go about getting this place looked at by a university or something of that nature, to come out and start a dig. There's so much history in this field and it would be a shame to lose all of it, expectantly with a midden of this size. There's no telling what might come out of that midden. Please help me with any info that might help me stop this large amount of history from being destroyed.
I've dug this spot only four times and this is what it has produce. I've been digging in the same hole each time, its now about 3'x4'.
   Attached files 
 

[rmartin]

Sorry to say this, but as the old saying goes, you are up a creek without a paddle. You could try a local university but they just don't have the funds to do anything as a rule. Big money talks as we all know and land developers are after one thing and could not care less. I still wouldn't give up, talk to anyone that will listen.

[robshap]

Every state has an archeologist. I would contact them. You can find contact info online. If the state archeologist declines to take a look, you could also contact your local archeology society. I'm sure they would love to have a peek.

[grombiz]

rmartin wrote:

Sorry to say this, but as the old saying goes, you are up a creek without a paddle. You could try a local university but they just don't have the funds to do anything as a rule. Big money talks as we all know and land developers are after one thing and could not care less. I still wouldn't give up, talk to anyone that will listen.

  Hey Rmartin, this saddens me to hear you say that. there's gotta be a way. How can people just destroy thousands of years of history and replace it with a house that wont last 100 years, just for a buck. The more I think about it, the amount of arrowheads that would be unearthed with a midden of this size. Well... Would bring in more money then that house by a lot. I live in Austin,TX so the university of Texas might jump all over a midden of this size. This just make me sick to think that I might have to just sit back and watch this happen. If the university doesn't do it, I'm thinking that someone out there might want to buy that piece of land and start a pay dig. I cant be the only one that care enough to stop this from happening. Let me show you what I've pulled out of the only hole I've dug. I've only been to this spot 4 times. This might give you an idea of the possibilities this midden holds.
   Attached files 
 

[jimr]

do you want to preserve it for yourself, then buy the land.
or
do you want to screw the land owner by trying to lock his land up in some legal battle over a possible prehistoric site not to be disturbed until fully excavated, in which case most everything that is recovered will be stashed away in some museum basement an never displayed for the public. (this does happen a lot)
or
do you just enjoy what you can while you can.
not trying to be sarcastic but that is the way it is. every year i see houses setting in spots that were very productive for artifacts. it's sad but we loose good hunting ground every year.   jim

[Neanderthal]

Your pics are way too small for me to see much, I don't know if it's just me or what.

[rmartin]

Well, like I said, don't give up. Talk to anyone who will listen. I agree that is a shame to see a site such as this destroyed. I really do wish you luck and keep us informed.

[twiasp]

I assume you have permission to dig there from the "old man" owner who is selling the property. You digging I think is also a form of destruction but with some preservation. The scenarios i am seeing are these.
1. Land developer goes crazy with a dozer, ask permission to surface hunt while you can, am sure he won't let you dig holes in the property he is leveling and grading, or with big machinery working.
2. An individual buys the land and does nothing with it and lets you continue to dig or tells you that you can't.
3. A Landman (very plentiful in Texas) buys it, they buy land as well as leasing mineral rights to properties, in which case he may let you dig since it isn't about resources he farms massly.
4. A university buys the land to preserve it, then I highly doubt they would let you dig and very seriously doubt they would charge people to dig, it kinda goes against the word preservation.
5. An archeology society deems it important and protects it or historic society does the same, either way i think you are done for digging it legally.
I am sure there are other scenarios but these are the ones that pop up in my mind. My suggestions are...
1. Find money somehow to purchase the land. Through a bank, family, friends, sugar momma's, etc....
2. Dig as fast as you can now and possibly destroy some of your history to save some of it also, with permission of land owner of course. Seems like a jumpin the gun sort of way though.
3. Or play out the crap shoot and see what ends up happening to the land and play it out from there. Always very possible the old man passes it to his children, even more possible if the land has been in his possession/family for years.
That is all,
Shawn

[Hoss]

I moved your two threads into one category. They are the same thread and there is no need for them to be redundant. This is also the same story I heard from you when you joined the site back in February.

[turkeytail]

The largest mound in the state of Michigan is now flattened and a factory exists there... totally sucks. inch:

[Bone2stone]

This haunts me to think that another site will bite the dust.
I too felt the bitter bite of seeing one of my favorite sites go by the way to construction.
The equipment moved in and now there is an Industrial complex sitting on one of the most productive sites in the DFW area.
They not only took out a habitation site they also buried a fossiliferous site as well.
On the lesser side they also buried a Pre WWII bottle dump site.
I found it all out there it was a dream site to me, being that I am a bottle/artifact/fossil collector.
You may try and contact some of the other pay dig sites (Several around your area)and inform them of the delemma. They may have contacts that have some deep pockets and take the overburdon off their hands (A truck losd at a time)and in turn give the sifted material back in a clean/gleaned form.
It would definately require some heavy equipment and a little time to achieve this but it is one alternative to losing out on all that potential.
Bone2stone